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	<title>Comments on: Someone should talk to Ron Dellums about honesty</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16</link>
	<description>The Continuing Story of a City</description>
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		<title>By: Marleen Sacks</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2953</link>
		<dc:creator>Marleen Sacks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 16:35:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2953</guid>
		<description>Vivek - pretty much, yes.  In a nutshell, what I was arguing was that the language of Measure Y was ambiguous, and therefore, the court should be permitted to consider &quot;extrinsic&quot; documents, such as the FAQ published on the City&#039;s website.  The language was ambiguous, because the titles/headings in the measure (written in all capital letters) referred to &quot;minimum staffing&quot; not minimum &quot;appropriation,&quot; whatever that means.  Therefore, the average voter (who does not parce the language like a lawyer might) and just glances at the language, with the all capped portion leaping out at him/her, would believe that the City was promising not to collect the tax unless the minimum staffing was at 739.  The FAQ published by the City specifically told people that the tax would not be collected unless the force was staffed at 739.  A TOTAL LIE!!!  But the judge said chapter headings/titles could not create ambiguity, and it was the actual text of the measure that mattered.  He basically said that voters need to examine each and every word of the ballot measure like they were scrutinizing an escrow contract, and that they have to assume that government officials are all lying to them.  So voters beware - read &quot;Son of Measure Y&quot; in its entirety, and you will see it promises us NO INCREASE in police officers AT ALL!  It is just about taking our money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Vivek &#8211; pretty much, yes.  In a nutshell, what I was arguing was that the language of Measure Y was ambiguous, and therefore, the court should be permitted to consider &#8220;extrinsic&#8221; documents, such as the FAQ published on the City&#8217;s website.  The language was ambiguous, because the titles/headings in the measure (written in all capital letters) referred to &#8220;minimum staffing&#8221; not minimum &#8220;appropriation,&#8221; whatever that means.  Therefore, the average voter (who does not parce the language like a lawyer might) and just glances at the language, with the all capped portion leaping out at him/her, would believe that the City was promising not to collect the tax unless the minimum staffing was at 739.  The FAQ published by the City specifically told people that the tax would not be collected unless the force was staffed at 739.  A TOTAL LIE!!!  But the judge said chapter headings/titles could not create ambiguity, and it was the actual text of the measure that mattered.  He basically said that voters need to examine each and every word of the ballot measure like they were scrutinizing an escrow contract, and that they have to assume that government officials are all lying to them.  So voters beware &#8211; read &#8220;Son of Measure Y&#8221; in its entirety, and you will see it promises us NO INCREASE in police officers AT ALL!  It is just about taking our money.</p>
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		<title>By: VivekB</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2949</link>
		<dc:creator>VivekB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 02:48:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2949</guid>
		<description>Someone just posted the summary of the Judge ruling about Marleen&#039;s suit about Measure Y on another forum i&#039;m on, i won&#039;t paste it all, but here&#039;s the salient bit. It sounds positively awful.

&quot; ... Roesch said he is bound by the language in the measure itself, which he said &quot;is not ambiguous&quot; in allowing the city to collect Measure Y taxes as long as the money is appropriated for more officers...
The measure doesn&#039;t explicitly require that that the additional officers authorized by the measure be hired, Roesch said....
Roesch said, &quot;I may say it&#039;s unjust and I don&#039;t like it&quot; but he doesn&#039;t know of any legal authority that would allow him to him to rule against the city, based on a ruling by the state Court of Appeals in a similar case.&quot;

And this, ladies &amp; gentleman, is exactly why the new tax is an awful idea.

If y&#039;all want to read the full text, it&#039;s here.  Marleen - was that summary accurate? http://rockridgeresidents.org/forums/showthread.php?t=160</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone just posted the summary of the Judge ruling about Marleen&#8217;s suit about Measure Y on another forum i&#8217;m on, i won&#8217;t paste it all, but here&#8217;s the salient bit. It sounds positively awful.</p>
<p>&#8221; &#8230; Roesch said he is bound by the language in the measure itself, which he said &#8220;is not ambiguous&#8221; in allowing the city to collect Measure Y taxes as long as the money is appropriated for more officers&#8230;<br />
The measure doesn&#8217;t explicitly require that that the additional officers authorized by the measure be hired, Roesch said&#8230;.<br />
Roesch said, &#8220;I may say it&#8217;s unjust and I don&#8217;t like it&#8221; but he doesn&#8217;t know of any legal authority that would allow him to him to rule against the city, based on a ruling by the state Court of Appeals in a similar case.&#8221;</p>
<p>And this, ladies &amp; gentleman, is exactly why the new tax is an awful idea.</p>
<p>If y&#8217;all want to read the full text, it&#8217;s here.  Marleen &#8211; was that summary accurate? <a href="http://rockridgeresidents.org/forums/showthread.php?t=160" rel="nofollow">http://rockridgeresidents.org/forums/showthread.php?t=160</a></p>
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		<title>By: J. Given</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2945</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Given</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 20:27:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2945</guid>
		<description>I just read about the ruling in Marleen&#039;s suit.  It&#039;s definitely buyer beware when it comes to voting for city measures.  When Measure Y passed, we got the measure we voted for, but it wasn&#039;t the same one that was described to us.

What gets me is that when some voters pointed out obvious deficiencies in the plain language of Measure Y *before* its enactment, they were shouted down the council.  

There are only two explanations for this hostility to questions about Measure Y:  either our council members lack even the most rudimentary skills in legislative construction, or they intentionally mislead the voters.  I suspect it&#039;s a little from column A, and a little from column B.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just read about the ruling in Marleen&#8217;s suit.  It&#8217;s definitely buyer beware when it comes to voting for city measures.  When Measure Y passed, we got the measure we voted for, but it wasn&#8217;t the same one that was described to us.</p>
<p>What gets me is that when some voters pointed out obvious deficiencies in the plain language of Measure Y *before* its enactment, they were shouted down the council.  </p>
<p>There are only two explanations for this hostility to questions about Measure Y:  either our council members lack even the most rudimentary skills in legislative construction, or they intentionally mislead the voters.  I suspect it&#8217;s a little from column A, and a little from column B.</p>
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		<title>By: Marleen Sacks</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2943</link>
		<dc:creator>Marleen Sacks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 19:36:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2943</guid>
		<description>Hey Len - thanks for your offer, but I actually don&#039;t need anybody&#039;s money.  I&#039;m a lawyer myself and am suing the City on my own time.  I decided to sue after a year of researching the abuses with Measure Y, and after my attempts to persuade the council to vote against the $7.7 million &quot;recruitment program&quot; were ignored.  I&#039;m sorry, but general police recruiting absolutely has to be paid for out of the General Fund.  The City simply grabbed the Measure Y money because the City was broke, and Measure Y was flush.  Why was it flush?  Because it was accumulating funds for the police officers it was supposed to hire, but never did. 

So to &quot;Born in Oakland&quot; - just because you give the City the money, that doesn&#039;t mean they&#039;ll spend it on police officers.  You should be aware that 40% of the police academy training costs for Deborah Edgerly&#039;s daughter, who flunked the academy four times(!) were likely paid for by Measure Y.  I don&#039;t think that&#039;s what the voters had in mind when they voted for the measure....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Len &#8211; thanks for your offer, but I actually don&#8217;t need anybody&#8217;s money.  I&#8217;m a lawyer myself and am suing the City on my own time.  I decided to sue after a year of researching the abuses with Measure Y, and after my attempts to persuade the council to vote against the $7.7 million &#8220;recruitment program&#8221; were ignored.  I&#8217;m sorry, but general police recruiting absolutely has to be paid for out of the General Fund.  The City simply grabbed the Measure Y money because the City was broke, and Measure Y was flush.  Why was it flush?  Because it was accumulating funds for the police officers it was supposed to hire, but never did. </p>
<p>So to &#8220;Born in Oakland&#8221; &#8211; just because you give the City the money, that doesn&#8217;t mean they&#8217;ll spend it on police officers.  You should be aware that 40% of the police academy training costs for Deborah Edgerly&#8217;s daughter, who flunked the academy four times(!) were likely paid for by Measure Y.  I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s what the voters had in mind when they voted for the measure&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Joanna/OnTheGoJo</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2938</link>
		<dc:creator>Joanna/OnTheGoJo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 17:36:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2938</guid>
		<description>Born in Oakland - on some level I would agree with you EXCEPT that we can&#039;t even meet the desired number now because of retirement &amp; attrition, so how does adding even more money solve the problem?  I think there&#039;s a more inherrant (sp?) problem that needs to be solved in terms of figuring out what we can do to make our City more appealing so that cops want to stay here after graduating from the academy.

City Hall is still saying that we&#039;re going to meet the magic 803 number by the end of the year and I just don&#039;t see it.

At some point the City needs to take a step back and figure out their accounting nightmare.  I don&#039;t have faith in any of the numbers - budgeted or actual - at this point.  Show me the money going in and the money going out and show me that policies are in place just like any other public company.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Born in Oakland &#8211; on some level I would agree with you EXCEPT that we can&#8217;t even meet the desired number now because of retirement &amp; attrition, so how does adding even more money solve the problem?  I think there&#8217;s a more inherrant (sp?) problem that needs to be solved in terms of figuring out what we can do to make our City more appealing so that cops want to stay here after graduating from the academy.</p>
<p>City Hall is still saying that we&#8217;re going to meet the magic 803 number by the end of the year and I just don&#8217;t see it.</p>
<p>At some point the City needs to take a step back and figure out their accounting nightmare.  I don&#8217;t have faith in any of the numbers &#8211; budgeted or actual &#8211; at this point.  Show me the money going in and the money going out and show me that policies are in place just like any other public company.</p>
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		<title>By: Surfways</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2936</link>
		<dc:creator>Surfways</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 16:42:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2936</guid>
		<description>And talk to Jean Quan about basic mathematics.

In today&#039;s SF chronicle article, (Oakland deficit at 50 million), Jean claimed to have warned others that Edgerly&#039;s estimates were inflated and Quan knew that it would be short. 
Knowing that, why did she pout for a bigger general fund slice for the non-profits?  Although she did say they may have to cut some support positions for the police force. They better not compromise the police force again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And talk to Jean Quan about basic mathematics.</p>
<p>In today&#8217;s SF chronicle article, (Oakland deficit at 50 million), Jean claimed to have warned others that Edgerly&#8217;s estimates were inflated and Quan knew that it would be short.<br />
Knowing that, why did she pout for a bigger general fund slice for the non-profits?  Although she did say they may have to cut some support positions for the police force. They better not compromise the police force again.</p>
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		<title>By: VivekB</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2934</link>
		<dc:creator>VivekB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 15:14:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2934</guid>
		<description>Yep, zero confidence here that the police property tax will actually go to police, and not to subsidize a new car for the City Council folks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yep, zero confidence here that the police property tax will actually go to police, and not to subsidize a new car for the City Council folks.</p>
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		<title>By: len raphael</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2933</link>
		<dc:creator>len raphael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 05:29:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2933</guid>
		<description>born oakland, 

for the +200/year cost it would still take several years to get to a mediocre policing level that&#039;s unlikely to make a substantial difference in the quality of life in any neighborhood  unless all those additional cops and investigators are dedicated to a few sections of east oakland.

by voting for that you would be giving up the best chance in years to force  our elected officials pay for adequate levels of basic city services of policing and infrastructure out of existing revenues before they subsidized the array of porkbarrel &quot;programs&quot; and non-profit organizations that thrive in Oakland as tax paying businesses depart or stagnate.

if we don&#039;t restrain our officials ineffective spending now, the Measure Y parcel tax , $200 police parcel tax, the LLAD tax increase, the kidsfirst parcel, will only be the foundation for a bigger  muni finance ponzi scheme that eventually will collapse with very painful consequences for city residents.

vote no and send the $200 to marlene sacks to defray her costs suing Oakland over Measure Y and possibly the recent LLAD (i have no connection to sacks, and don&#039;t even know if she&#039;ll accept our money. but if she would post an address here, i&#039;ll contribute.)

-len raphael
temescal</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>born oakland, </p>
<p>for the +200/year cost it would still take several years to get to a mediocre policing level that&#8217;s unlikely to make a substantial difference in the quality of life in any neighborhood  unless all those additional cops and investigators are dedicated to a few sections of east oakland.</p>
<p>by voting for that you would be giving up the best chance in years to force  our elected officials pay for adequate levels of basic city services of policing and infrastructure out of existing revenues before they subsidized the array of porkbarrel &#8220;programs&#8221; and non-profit organizations that thrive in Oakland as tax paying businesses depart or stagnate.</p>
<p>if we don&#8217;t restrain our officials ineffective spending now, the Measure Y parcel tax , $200 police parcel tax, the LLAD tax increase, the kidsfirst parcel, will only be the foundation for a bigger  muni finance ponzi scheme that eventually will collapse with very painful consequences for city residents.</p>
<p>vote no and send the $200 to marlene sacks to defray her costs suing Oakland over Measure Y and possibly the recent LLAD (i have no connection to sacks, and don&#8217;t even know if she&#8217;ll accept our money. but if she would post an address here, i&#8217;ll contribute.)</p>
<p>-len raphael<br />
temescal</p>
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		<title>By: Born in Oakland</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2932</link>
		<dc:creator>Born in Oakland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 04:05:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2932</guid>
		<description>I have distrust and disgust for City policy but I want more police.  I do not think we can gamble on this in order to send a message/make a point.  We were burned on Measure Y but cannot afford to &quot;send a message.&quot;  Paraphrasing a city council person, the tax will cost me four (tanks) of gas the last year.  I will vote for everything that gets us more police on the force.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have distrust and disgust for City policy but I want more police.  I do not think we can gamble on this in order to send a message/make a point.  We were burned on Measure Y but cannot afford to &#8220;send a message.&#8221;  Paraphrasing a city council person, the tax will cost me four (tanks) of gas the last year.  I will vote for everything that gets us more police on the force.</p>
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		<title>By: avis</title>
		<link>http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2929</link>
		<dc:creator>avis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jul 2008 23:17:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.abetteroakland.com/someone-should-talk-to-ron-dellums-about-honesty/2008-07-16#comment-2929</guid>
		<description>I remember Danny Wan (Pat Kernighan&#039;s predecessor) calling me the night before we all voted on Measure Y, he pleaded with my husband and I to vote for Measure Y.  We said we would not vote for Measure Y because we did not trust the City Council to use the money effectively and didn&#039;t think we would get more cops out of the deal.  I don&#039;t see how anything has changed, City Hall continues to show us how diligently they can waste, squander and steal our tax dollars.  

Do you really believe if this passes that we will get what they promise us?  Jean Quan is already screaming that Oakland non-profits need more money (It&#039;s for the Children) and its really not too far of a stretch to see where this money (no Sunset clause) will end up.  
There may be people in Oakland who still believe the folks downtown, but no one in my house belongs to that group.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember Danny Wan (Pat Kernighan&#8217;s predecessor) calling me the night before we all voted on Measure Y, he pleaded with my husband and I to vote for Measure Y.  We said we would not vote for Measure Y because we did not trust the City Council to use the money effectively and didn&#8217;t think we would get more cops out of the deal.  I don&#8217;t see how anything has changed, City Hall continues to show us how diligently they can waste, squander and steal our tax dollars.  </p>
<p>Do you really believe if this passes that we will get what they promise us?  Jean Quan is already screaming that Oakland non-profits need more money (It&#8217;s for the Children) and its really not too far of a stretch to see where this money (no Sunset clause) will end up.<br />
There may be people in Oakland who still believe the folks downtown, but no one in my house belongs to that group.</p>
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